Any ideas as to type of Bamboo? Ans. Phyllostachys rubromarginata

[floraman1]

Largest culms are 2 and 3 inches.

[Mark Meckes]

Hi floraman,
It's a little difficult to guess ... if some culms are getting to 3" in diameter
... one guess would be Phyllostachys viridis (http://www.bamboocraft.net/bamboo/showgallery.php?cat=550) (pics at Bamboo Flora)
One way to tell if it is P. viridis is if there is a very slight dimpling of the culm surface, which can be felt if one lightly touches the surface in an up/down motion.

If you can upload more pics and if possible make them a larger size we can look for any clues that might help confirm the ID of this bamboo.

Mark

[floraman1]

These are large pics. Thanks for your help, Mark.

[sasa fool]

The photos are too large for my patience with my dial-up connection, but how about Phy. rubromarginata? Those look like pretty long internodes, vertical culms that don't taper much - just a guess though.

[Mark Meckes]

Brad, I understand you dialup dilema but higher resolution pics makes it possible to take a closer look. (It's just not possible to enlarge a low resolution pic without it going "grainy")
After I check the pics out I do resize them to a lower KB value.
(I usually try and do this within a day or so, though I have some older past posts I still need to resize).
Pics then get cross-linked to the gallery which provides additional viewing modes for slow or fast connections.
Anyway, one thing that is emphasized in species ID? posting instructions is that time and patience is necessary ... to get good pics, to get seasonal pics, sometimes new shoots are the final key, and to allow time to formulate a thorough response and to list various possible key ID indicators.

Now, as mentioned, the internodes are fairly long, so a good possibility is ...
Phyllostachys rubromarginata (http://www.bamboocraft.net/bamboo/showgallery.php?cat=512) (pics at Bamboo Flora)

Other P. rubromarginata traits are ..
- the side branches often grow at a more upward angle from the node than some Phyllostachys species
- nodes are not very prominent
- new year's culms may have a very fine fuzzy coating as shown here:
http://www.bamboocraft.net/bamboo/data/512/thumbs/PrubroAuTX060517-3014.jpg (http://www.bamboocraft.net/bamboo/showphoto.php?photo=3427)
Can you check this out floraman?
- sometimes under good (adequate moisture) growing conditions the bottom part of the internode, just above the node will have a slight to very noticeable bulge as shown here: (often more pronounced in larger diameter culms)
http://www.bamboocraft.net/bamboo/data/512/thumbs/PrubroPtrTX060228-1506.jpg (http://www.bamboocraft.net/bamboo/showphoto.php?photo=3337)
- for their diameter, the mid-upper culm walls are somewhat comparably thin.

floraman, What state, and general region, topography (near stream /hillside etc) is this boo growing at?
This kind of info is very helpful so that we may learn more how different species grow in different regions and growing conditions.
Older groves can also sometimes be traced back to a time when fewer species were more commonly available.

Also please do upload more pics as you can, and the best focused pics will be placed in your gallery/category at Bamboo Flora.
(Of course you can also upload directly to the gallery, though there are upload size restrictions there)
It is not necessary that they be "pretty" pics as wild overgrown groves can reveal much more of the cycle of the plant and quality/durability/degradation rate of old culms etc etc..
It's just a lot harder to take pics when surrounded by a jungle of growth. :eek:

Cheers,
Mark

[sasa fool]

Brad, I understand you dialup dilema but higher resolution pics makes it possible to take a closer look. (It's just not possible to enlarge a low resolution pic without it going "grainy")
After I check the pics out I do resize them to a lower KB value.
(I usually try and do this within a day or so, though I have some older past posts I still need to resize).
Pics then get cross-linked to the gallery which provides additional viewing modes for slow or fast connections. Cheers,Mark

Mark, sorry, I wasn't grousing about the large file sizes, merely trying to qualify my Rubro guess with the fact that I had viewed only the thumbnails. I understand the need for large image files. When you live in the land of dial-up or nothing you become either extremely patient (I haven't), or you don't even try to view anything much over 250K, knowing that you are missing out on much of the internet experience.

Don't mean to start a new Rubro thread but I've never noticed the fuzzy new culms and will keep an eye out for this. Apparently I have 2 different clones of Phy. rubromarginata, or so I've been told, and will see if either shows this trait.

[Mark Meckes]

Brad, this has always concerned me, having members and visitors from around the world, many on slow connections, and this will be a problem for years to come.
I was just using your reference as an excuse to discuss this issue.
My biggest regret is that I didn't have the upload setting higher years ago, (due to my concern for viewers with slow connections), because there's no way now to increase the size of past pics without losing resolution.
This is particularly important for images requiring detailed close ups.
Higher resolution images also enables one to crop details within an image and still retain a large size image (pixels HxW).

There is an option at the gallery that members can replace an image already uploaded, with a larger/better quality resolution of the image.
Meanwhile I keep increasing the size allowed because the technology has been gradually continuing to improve, enabling viewers optional viewing modes depending on the connection speed.
... to be culmtinued ...

Back to rubro ...
That fuzz on the new culm surface is one of the darndest things to try and take a picture of, especially as my point and click camera doesn't have a manual focus. grr!#*%#

I can still feel it though, (very sparce) on year old culms that aren't exposed to full sun and or rubbed by other branches.
.. still trying to photograph some other ID indicators ...

Mark

[floraman1]

Here are some new photos. The pictures are of a grove (age unknown) located near LaGrange, Texas. The largest culms are 2 inches in diameter. The tallest culm is estimated 40+ feet tall. There were no shoots to take pictures of today. For a bit of reference, one or two of the pictures has a dead culm placed horizontally on a culm with purple flowers attached to it at the edge of the grove. It is at a height of 6 feet. Thanks for looking again.

[Mark Meckes]

Hi floraman,
Great pics! By the size of the grove it looks like it's been there a while, possibly measured in decades.
I think, because of the fairly long internodes that we can confirm that this is Phyllostachys rubromarginata
Also I believe I can see a slight bulging on the lower part of the internodes of the culms in the interior of the grove pic.

Did you manage to rub some of the newest culms lightly to see if they had any scant remnants of hairs?
I finally figured out how to get a pic of the sparse remaining hairs on our 5 month old culms - by shining a flashlight upwards on the culm.
Our planting is still quite young, intermixed with other bamboos, with a few culms just getting to 1"+ diameter.
http://www.bamboocraft.net/bamboo/data/512/thumbs/PrubroAuTX070912-8997.jpg (http://www.bamboocraft.net/bamboo/showphoto.php?photo=5072) View large (http://www.bamboocraft.net/bamboo/showphoto.php?photo=5072&size=big) - to see a few hairs on the left of culm.

Another trait is the long fringe of hairs attached to the leaf sheaths.
These mostly break off by the second year and are most noticeable on current years' leaves.
http://www.bamboocraft.net/bamboo/data/512/medium/PrubroAuTX070910-8970.jpg (http://www.bamboocraft.net/bamboo/showphoto.php?photo=5071) View large (http://www.bamboocraft.net/bamboo/showphoto.php?photo=5071&size=big)

The grey coating is mostly sooty mold, a side effect from the honey dew produced by the Noxious Mealybug - Antonina pretiosa, which is evident by the white cottony substance at the junction of the leaf on the lower left.

In central Texas Phyllostachys rubromarginata shoots begin to emerge generally before or after mid April.
They arrive a little later than our more commonly growing Phyllostachys aurea (Golden Bamboo) which usually begin to emerge generally around mid March thru April.
The shoot emergence season varies with warming temperatures and amount of rainfall, both which speed up their time of arrival.

Mark

[floraman1]

Mark,

Thanks for your input. Mark, I did not check for hairs on the culms and was not aware of the long fringe hairs on the leaf sheaths. I checked for any emerging shoots, but there were none. Perhaps I can get some close up photos of the leaf sheaths another time. The internodes on the larger culms were likely 15 to 16 inches in length (I had a measuring tape, but forgot to take that measurement). Somehow, I think the photos make them appear longer than they actually are. Do you think photos of the shoots this coming spring would help significantly toward making a positive identification? Also, the actual owners may be able to provide more info since they live close to the grove.
Again, Mark, thank you for your help.

Ed

[Mark Meckes]

Hi Ed,
I'm 90+% sure that it is Phyllostachys rubromarginata, but pics of emerging shoots will confirm it for sure.
P. rubromarginata has, as far as I know, the longest internode length of any Phyllostachys species. Also with their not very prominent nodal ridge, the slight bulge of the lower portion of the internode in large diameter culms, plus other subtle indicators ... this is a species that one can be able to ID at most times once one becomes familiar with it.

Please do take more pics when you can as we love to see shots of these larger maturing and wild groves which are so much more expressive.
It takes a lot of pics to sort through and capture special moments in the life of a 'boo, so click away!

BTW the longest internode length I've measured so far of P. rubro was 24" (61cm) growing in a gully in Alabama, which was made into this plosive percussion instrument by Stan Skov:
http://www.bamboocraft.net/gallery/data/527/thumbs/346Mvc-077f.jpg (http://www.bamboocraft.net/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=563&cat=527&ppuser=346)

Abundant moisture and a fervent need to reach skyward are required for rubro culm internodes to grow this long, and only a few on the whole culm attained this length.

Mark

[floraman1]

Thanks Mark. Here are a few more pics of the interior of this grove.