Bamboo for aircraft construction.

[gibby2sun]

Does anyone know about using bamboo for aircraft construction? How does the strength and weight of bamboo compare to a wood like spruce? I am asking this because I want to build a kit airplane, (not a model, but full size), and spruce is used for the wings. I would like to use bamboo instead mainly for environmental reasons. However it might accually be stronger and lighter.

[Mark Meckes]

Hi gibby2sun,
I did a search a while back on this subject and about all I could find related to using bamboo in aircraft construction was it's use in the early pioneering era and for glider construction.

Here's several links/articles I came up with that mentioned using bamboo:

Dumont's Demoiselle Information (http://www.fiddlersgreen.net/AC/aircraft/DuMont-Demoiselle/info/info.htm)

Gustave Whitehead: Did He Beat the Wright Brothers into the Sky? (http://www.unmuseum.org/gustave.htm)

Who invented the flex wing hang glider? (http://www.bchpa.org/newsletter/may04/hghistory.htm) - By Mark Woodhams

Percy Sinclair Pilcher (1866 - 1899) (http://www.ctie.monash.edu.au/hargrave/pilcher.html)

With the advances in technologies using composites, and the greater availability of 'elite' bamboo species, I'm sure it would be possible to use bamboo as a component of aircraft construction. ;)

Additionally one could probably learn a lot from the uses of bamboo in kite construction.

Here's also a link to the Bamboo Kite Making Forum (http://www.bamboocraft.net/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=163)

Mark

[RaptorWing]

I earlier sent Mark a private message because he's local and I'm a very tactile learner. Sure, great information can be shared here in the forum, and pictures of different species and their descriptions and characteristics are great, but I'm afraid I won't know which one suits me until I've touched it.

Also, in the forum I'd be more hesitant to give out specific details about my project until it is further along in development. I'd be asking for info without giving enough myself. . . not fair to make y'all guess what I want. I guess ultimately, using bamboo to build experimental aircraft would be the direction I'm heading, but the current design I'm working on falls somewhere in between the following two links in terms of lifting ability, design, performance. . . still ambiguous, but you can see the range... bigger than your average kite!

http://www.drachen.org/about_archive_cody02.html

I don't know what spars are used for these particular kites, but I'd trust one of the designs utilizing bamboo to hoist myself aloft for spotting traffic on I-35.

Whereas this next one. . . I'm going to need a lot more experience before I try building anything of this caliber by lashing a couple of poles together!

http://www.popularmechanics.com/blogs/outdoors_news/3354661.html

[Mark Meckes]

Hi RaptorWing,
Very interesting links!
Regarding your search for bamboo to suit your needs, as there are many types of other manufactured materials available providing both consistent strength and lightweight properties for 'airborne vehicular' uses, I suppose their specific properties and uses could serve as the basis for determining whether bamboo could be used instead.

Also due to the stringent safety requirements involved, selecting bamboo for these uses I think would depend primarily on it's strength vs weight, and whether other components or combinations of materials, connectors etc in addition to bamboo were being used.
I envision this could involve a lot of testing and comparative evaluation, initially based on the best bamboo materials readily available to initially determine it's suitability. From this research one could set requirements or standards in which to seek higher quality or specific properties from select portions of readily available bamboo, or it may necessitate seeking more elite or harder to find bamboo species to suit said purposes.

Now a ramble ...
We (in the US) have been endowed with hundreds of species of bamboo introduced from all parts of the world, which have many possible applications for craft and construction uses.
However because historically their were no bamboos native to Europe, nor has there till fairly recently been much interest in bamboo by the 'Western' culture, there is a tremendous void of knowledge in the learning institutions on this subject.
Currently the main driving force on the uses of bamboo is in the horticultural sector, and the general commercial availability of domestically grown bamboo is still very much in it's embryonic formative stages.
We have a long way to go before individuals like yourself will be able to easily get access to the diversity of species materials and evaluate their properties for various uses based on differing regional growing conditions, and that have been harvested, graded and treated for optimum quality.

But bamboo is a plant that MUST over time be annually and selectively harvested from - there is no 30 year wait like with fast growing trees.
So until a number of growers become regional suppliers, and providing it doesn't become a monocultural industry focusing on just a few species of bamboo as has happened with the domestic forestry industry, we will, for some time to come, be relying on the 'horticultural sector' to get access to harvested materials of the many species.

Fortunately the internet came along just at the right time for sharing information, ideas and experiences with bamboo, but the main hinderance to speeding up the exchange of knowledge, is as you mentioned, 'human nature'.
Yep, we live in a dog eat dog culmpetitive world and one in which personal ambitions and egos are coveted with relish.
Now, this site is pretty laid back, doesn't have a major agenda, mission or goals to change the world but merely provides a platform for free exchange.
Hopefully over time we can add to what is here and organize things a little better so as not to waste peoples time to find what they need.

Thanks for your culmtributions and as always questions are as important as any answers that may eventually follow.

Cheers,
Mark

[RaptorWing]

Thanks, Mark, for your reply. I haven't actually read the Popular Mechanics article since it's publish date, but when I saw it online I recognized it and that's what I wanted for illustrative purposes. I have no intention (yet) of adding a 90hp Rotax engine to an oversized bamboo stick kite. I can't remember if those kite wings are classified as "ultralights" or if they fit into the new category of "light sport" planes. If it's under 254# and 55 mph, then it's UL but I think they fly faster than 55 if I remember right.

An ultimate long-term goal for me would be a powered craft in the ultralight category, but based on my knowledge and experiences, I feel it would be appropriate to start with a 3-5 square meter kite. I've built many smaller kites in the past, and when I got wind of "powerkiting" I made a couple of 3 meter (sparless) parawing kites. One was never finished, but the one that was was phenonemal. Its last flight before breaking pieces of the harness was at a particularly windy Zilker kite festival. It was 2-3 years ago.

considering my myriad interests and natural creativity, i'm doing my best to combine them in ways which will hopefully make sense to a lot of different people even if not for the same reasons. Artistic, practical, responsible and fun reasons. The year I crashed my wife's parawing was the last time I made it to Zilker, but I have been to TSD's deaf kite festival, making a kite (including the spars) entirely from paper. Next year I want to give a whole new look to the classic bamboo.

I guess my next question would fit in a different thread so feel free to quote it wherever it rightfully belongs. I know most bamboo is tropical through moderate in climate. At home in Texas our lot is small, but I do have access to a few acres to play with in Minnesota (northern) Know any species that will grow that far north?

[Mark Meckes]

Hi Aaron,
I will make a culmcerted effort to attend Zilker (Austin) Kite Festival (http://www.zilkerkitefestival.com/) next year. (Things have kept coming up causing me to miss this event)

You should try and make it to the 15th Annual Texas Bamboo Festival (http://www.bamboocraft.net/forums/showthread.php?t=2474) - August 25 - 26, 2007 at Zilker Botanical Garden, Austin Texas

It will be a great opportunity to talk boo with growers and crafters, plus this year there will be a bamboo kite making workshop (http://www.bamboocraft.net/forums/showthread.php?t=2499). :)

I do have access to a few acres to play with in Minnesota (northern) Know any species that will grow that far north?

Here's a thread discussing Bamboo craft species for extreme cold climates (http://www.bamboocraft.net/forums/showthread.php?t=358)

Mark