ID? 'Giant' Arrow Bamboo (Pseudosasa longiligula?)

[ShmuBamboo]

Here is one of three giant arrows I brought home, compared to one of my smaller arrow bamboos to the left.

http://www.bamboocraft.net/bamboo/data/767/medium/DSCN0836.jpg (http://www.bamboocraft.net/bamboo/showphoto.php?photo=4262) View large (http://www.bamboocraft.net/bamboo/showphoto.php?photo=4262&cat=767&size=big)
The large one is about 10 ft tall, and I had to cut it in half (was 20 ft) just so I could get it home in my pickup truck. It is so large I thought that it was a different species!

[Mark Meckes]

I'm wondering if this could be Pseudosasa amabilis (http://www.bamboocraft.net/bamboo/showgallery.php?cat=599) - Tonkin Cane (pics at Bamboo Flora)

It was till fairly recently called Arundinaria amabilis

Again, I was recently able to take some more pics of this species but need to sort through them before uploading to the gallery.

Meanwhile here's a couple pics:
923 924

Note the hairy culm sheaths. The hairs gradually fall off.
Unlike Pseudosasa japonica - Arrow Bamboo, which has persistant sheaths, P. amabilis sheaths detach eventually.

Have yours started to send up new shoots this year in your area?

Mark

[ShmuBamboo]

A few arrows here have new shoots, but most have new side shoots from older culms. I have some 'true' arrow bamboos from my brother and some that I dragged here from Carmel. I will look more closely at the sheaths and compare them. One thing that distinguishes this 'giant arrow' type from arrow bamboo is that the hedge we cut it from looked just like the potted plant in my photo (except it was a lot taller). It did not have lower leaves that filled in the 'hedge'. The lower culms were naturally open. The leaves were at the tops and tips of the branches. This type also did a number on the sidewalk with the invasive roots, supposedly arrow is not so distructive. It is definately a runner... It was also very tall... 20 ft at least. Also the yard that we got this from had only exotic species in it. None were common types of bamboo that I recognized, and obviously the previous owner of the house was a collector. The new owners wanted nothing to do with bamboo, and have probably since wiped them out by flooding all the roots except a patch of giant green bamboo at the back of the house (where I got the clumps that the owner said was 'vivax'). Most of my unknown types are from that house (4 of them anyway).

[ShmuBamboo]

OK, rooting around in the bamboo garden, I compared the arrows with the giant 'arrow' and all of the arrows are putting up new shoots. None of the giants are. The giants are putting out new leaf nodes though. There are tiny hairs on the sheaths, but there are also tiny hairs on the sheath of arrow (looking at them just right in the sun).

[Mark Meckes]

Pseudosasa japonica culm sheaths are only lightly hairy when fresh:
http://www.bamboocraft.net/bamboo/data/532/thumbs/Ps-japonicaAuTX_050522-4892.jpg (http://www.bamboocraft.net/bamboo/showphoto.php?photo=1375)

Pseudosasa japonica culm sheath ligule (behind sheath blade)
http://www.bamboocraft.net/bamboo/data/532/thumbs/Ps-japonicaAuTX_050522-491.jpg (http://www.bamboocraft.net/bamboo/showphoto.php?photo=1374)

Pseudosasa amabilis sheath blades grow quite long, clasping the culm, but often break off when they change to a parchment color:
927

The branch leaf sheaths of P. japonica don't appear to have any auricles to speak of:
http://www.bamboocraft.net/bamboo/data/532/thumbs/Ps-japonicaAuTX_050522-488.jpg (http://www.bamboocraft.net/bamboo/showphoto.php?photo=1373)

... whereas P. amabilis is positively frilly:
925 926

P. japonica lower culm sheaths persistently cling to their culms throughout their life, ... with the exception of where new branches form higher upon the second year of a culms life, when they are pushed out of the way for the new side branches.

... There are a couple more species options, but we'll see what you think first before exploring these ... possibly will need more pics of shoot sheaths etc. etc.

Mark

[ShmuBamboo]

Another observation here... comparing the arrows to the 'giant', I noticed that arrow tends not to grow new leaves from a leafed out branch, and puts out side shoots from nodes. Whereas the 'giant' puts out new leaves from the old branch tips as well as new branches from nodes. Here is a photo of what I mean of a new leaf shoot from an older leafed branch.

http://www.bamboocraft.net/bamboo/data/767/medium/DSCN0847.JPG (http://www.bamboocraft.net/bamboo/showphoto.php?photo=4263) View large (http://www.bamboocraft.net/bamboo/showphoto.php?photo=4263&cat=767&size=big)

The other photos of observations are too fuzzy... my camera has autofocus and I have to bypass it and re-take some photos.

[ShmuBamboo]

Here is an attempt to show the hairs at the base of some new branches of the giant.

http://www.bamboocraft.net/bamboo/data/767/thumbs/DSCN0849.jpg (http://www.bamboocraft.net/bamboo/showphoto.php?photo=4264) View large (http://www.bamboocraft.net/bamboo/showphoto.php?photo=4264&cat=767&size=big)

[Mark Meckes]

Hmmm by the look of you latest pic of the shoot, I may have led you up the wrong garden path ... IE, I think it might be something else ...

My new guess is a Sinobambusa species

Here's a few pics at the gallery (http://www.bamboocraft.net/bamboo/showgallery.php?cat=588) ... alas I don't have ready access to any Sinobambusa sp. plants nearby,
... with the exception of the variegated form, Sinobambusa tootsik 'Albostriata'.
There was some culmfusion as the the correct species identity of the pics at the Byron GA USDA station in the above gallery, and this quest has revitilized my need to follow up on some queries as to their ID.

Q. Do the culm internodes surface on your plant have very thin vertical grooves? (Similar to the appearance of the 'old 33rpm records)

Mark

[Mark Meckes]

Nope. I checked my S. tootsik albostriata and the leaf sheaths are auriculate - got frills

Now I think just maybe I was on the right 'garden path'

Pseudosasa longiligula
Listed as growing to 25-26ft
Good strong canes like P. amabilis

See a couple pics here:
http://www.bamboogarden.com/Pseudosasa%20longiligula.html

According to this site:
http://www.kew.org/data/grasses-db/www/imp08709.htm

Culm-sheaths coriaceous; pilose; hairy on margins; concave at apex; auriculate; setose on shoulders.
..... Leaf-sheath auricles absent, or falcate ...

This species is a fairly new intro to the nursery trade (and you did mention the original owner was a collector) ...

Please do take more pics of all portions of this species when you can :)

Mark

[ShmuBamboo]

The height would be right at 25 ft. As for getting them from collectors, all my boos not from this farm seem to be from some better yard collections, left behind when property was sold (except for my brother's). I will try to get some better photos with my girlfriend's camera (when the rains quit).

[ShmuBamboo]

The thing about Sinobambusa is that the arrow 'giant' I have has sheaths that stay put for years. I have to pull them off pretty hard to get them off. They have withstood high wind, moving, handling, and my random pulling them off. So no way a natural stand of this stuff would have a lot of exposed culms as in these photos. They would have sheaths randomly hanging all over them. No large sections of bare culms, and not as in these photos. I will take some more photos and upload them to show you what I mean.

Hmmm by the look of you latest pic of the shoot, I may have led you up the wrong garden path ... IE, I think it something else ...

My new guess is a Sinobambusa species

Here's a few pics at the gallery (http://www.bamboocraft.net/bamboo/showgallery.php?cat=588) ... alas I don't have ready access to any Sinobambusa sp. plants nearby,
... with the exception of the variegated form, Sinobambusa tootsik 'Albostriata'.
There was some culmfusion as the the correct species identity of the pics at the Byron GA USDA station in the above gallery, and this quest has revitilized my need to follow up on some queries as to their ID.

Q. Do the culm internodes surface on your plant have very thin vertical grooves? (Similar to the appearance of the 'old 33rpm records)

Mark

[ShmuBamboo]

More photos here of odd parts of the plants...
http://www.bamboocraft.net/bamboo/data/767/thumbs/g_arrow_culms.jpg (http://www.bamboocraft.net/bamboo/showphoto.php?photo=4265) http://www.bamboocraft.net/bamboo/data/767/thumbs/g_arrow_fan2.jpg (http://www.bamboocraft.net/bamboo/showphoto.php?photo=4266) http://www.bamboocraft.net/bamboo/data/767/thumbs/g_arrow_sheath.jpg (http://www.bamboocraft.net/bamboo/showphoto.php?photo=4267) http://www.bamboocraft.net/bamboo/data/767/thumbs/g_arrow_sheath_cu.jpg (http://www.bamboocraft.net/bamboo/showphoto.php?photo=4268) http://www.bamboocraft.net/bamboo/data/767/thumbs/g_arrow_shoots.jpg (http://www.bamboocraft.net/bamboo/showphoto.php?photo=4269)

[sasa fool]

Is there always only 1 branch at the node?
Yes - keeps Ps. japonica in the game.
No - eliminates it.

[ShmuBamboo]

Excellent question/observation. There is only one branch per node. I thought there would be more than one branch per node, looking at the branches the likes of the photo in the set above at the far right. I peeled the sheaths back on that particular one and the branches shoot from 2 different nodes. Looking at all the fan-like branches like the ones in the second photo from the left, there are all single branches per node.

[ShmuBamboo]

Then these giant arrow boos will probalbly flower along with the arrow that I have. I was told a few years ago that my P. japonica would flower soon, but no blooms here yet. I have been reading that it has been blooming in some parts of asia for some time now. A culmination of pandamonium will certainly entail...

[Mark Meckes]

It can't be Pseudosasa japonica because your culm sheaths have auricles with oral setae.
This is why I think that it may well be Pseudosasa longiligula (http://www.bamboocraft.net/bamboo/showgallery.php?cat=767) (pics at Gallery Bamboo Flora

(Your pics have been uploaded to the gallery and cross linked to your posts. If we find it is something else we can move them,) however ...

According to this species description (below) ...
- Branch complement one, or two, or three.
- Leaf-sheath auricles absent
- Culm sheaths are coriaceous

Coriaceous = leathery
Resembling leather in appearance or consistence; tough. "A leathery skin." - Websters Dictionary
... which certainly resembles the sheaths in your pics, which are tougher than P. japonica sheaths.

Also of note, as per the ABS 2007 Source list, of 7 nurseries providing this species in the US, 4 are located in Oregon.

Detailed Info from the:
GrassBase - The Online World Grass Flora
By W.D. Clayton, K.T. Harman & H. Williamson

Pseudosasa longiligula
http://www.kew.org/data/grasses-db/www/imp08709.htm

HABIT: Perennial. Rhizomes elongated; leptomorph. Culms erect; 800 cm long; 50 mm diam.; woody. Culm-internodes terete; 40–56 cm long; distally glabrous. Lateral branches dendroid. Branch complement one, or two, or three. Culm-sheaths coriaceous; pilose; hairy on margins; concave at apex; auriculate; setose on shoulders. Culm-sheath ligule entire. Culm-sheath blade linear, or lanceolate; narrower than sheath; erect. Leaves cauline; 4–6 per branch. Leaf-sheaths 6 cm long; pubescent; outer margin hairy. Leaf-sheath oral hairs scanty. Leaf-sheath auricles absent, or falcate. Ligule a ciliolate membrane; 8 mm long. Leaf-blade base with a brief petiole-like connection to sheath. Leaf-blades lanceolate, or oblong; 15–22 cm long; 13–30 mm wide. Leaf-blade venation with 10–14 secondary veins; with distinct cross veins. Leaf-blade surface pubescent; hairy abaxially. Leaf-blade apex acuminate.

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Apparently this species produces good quality culms used in furniture making in China.
Regarding flowering, as P. longiligula is a distinct species, it is probable that it will have a different flowering cycle than P. japonica.

Looking forward to seeing more progressive pics of this plant. ;)
Mark

[sasa fool]

I have the Ps. longiligula and it has proven to be significantly less hardy than 'advertised' - probably equal to Ps. amabilis. Annual top kill has held the size down so I do not feel that I can easily ID it but one thing that seems unique is the coloration of new culms. At sheath fall they are a very dark green with bluish (pruinose) rings at the nodes. The leaves and culms in their first growing season are notably darker than Ps. japonica.

My question about the number of branches at the node was to see if it could be Ps. viridula, mine is WAY more vigorous and hardy than Ps. japonica and it reached 9 feet tall in year 3 by far the most vigor I've seen from any of the Pseudosasa. It is not common enough for me to learn of its performance in other climates but it has 3 branches at the node so it can be eliminated pretty easily.

What aspects would eliminate A. gigantea from a possibility for this one Mark?

[Mark Meckes]

Arundinaria gigantea leaf sheaths are auriculate with oral setae:
http://www.bamboocraft.net/bamboo/data/544/thumbs/Agigantea040829aZlk-514.jpg (http://www.bamboocraft.net/bamboo/showphoto.php?photo=1027) http://www.bamboocraft.net/bamboo/data/544/thumbs/Agigantea040829aZlk-515.jpg (http://www.bamboocraft.net/bamboo/showphoto.php?photo=1028)

A. gigantea culm sheath
http://www.bamboocraft.net/bamboo/data/543/thumbs/AgiganteaZBGATX050521-452.jpg (http://www.bamboocraft.net/bamboo/showphoto.php?photo=1359)

Interesting observation on the possibility of P. viridula.
Following is the description, with which to culmpare differences, from:

GrassBase - The Online World Grass Flora
W.D. Clayton, K.T. Harman & H. Williamson

Pseudosasa viridula
http://www.kew.org/data/grasses-db/www/imp08718.htm

HABIT Perennial. Rhizomes elongated; leptomorph. Culms erect; 400 cm long; 10 mm diam.; woody. Culm-internodes terete; thin-walled; 13–15 cm long; mid-green. Lateral branches dendroid; ascending. Branch complement one, or two, or three. Culm-sheaths chartaceous; pilose; with white hairs; hairy on margins; truncate at apex; auriculate; setose on shoulders; shoulders with straight hairs; shoulders with 5–10 mm long hairs. Culm-sheath ligule 1.5 mm high; ciliolate. Culm-sheath blade lanceolate; erect; acuminate. Leaves cauline; (2–)4–5 per branch. Leaf-sheaths hispid; outer margin hairy. Leaf-sheath oral hairs lacking. Leaf-sheath auricles absent. Ligule a ciliolate membrane; scaberulous on abaxial surface. Leaf-blade base with a brief petiole-like connection to sheath. Leaf-blades lanceolate, or elliptic; 8–30 cm long; 20–30 mm wide. Leaf-blade venation with 14–20 secondary veins. Leaf-blade surface puberulous; densely hairy; hairy abaxially. Leaf-blade margins scabrous. Leaf-blade apex acute.

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