Root-end bamboo for flute making

[Mark Meckes]

- What types of flutes and wind instruments are suited to use of bamboo with it's root-end still intact?
- What types of bamboo species can be used ?
- What diameters, culm wall thicknesses, hole-bore sizes, internode lengths other charactistics make the root-end bamboo suitable for flute material?
- Harvesting, processing, drying and curing ...

Discuss it here!

Here's a very interesting article at Monty's Tai Hei Shakuhachi Website about a journey to Japan, and ...
harvesting bamboo for shakuhachi. (http://www.shakuhachi.com/J-N-Harvest-00.html)

[ericswain]

- What types of flutes and wind instruments are suited to use of bamboo with it's root-end still intact?
Shakuhachi are the only instruments that I know of where the root end of the bamboo is still on.

- What types of bamboo species can be used ?
Madake is the most common type. Black bamboo can also be used if its big enough.

- What diameters, culm wall thicknesses, hole-bore sizes, internode lengths other charactistics make the root-end bamboo suitable for flute material?
I'm not an expert but the wall thickness should be between 1/8th inch and 1/4 inch
There should be a total of seven nodes with a length of between 15 and 30 inches. Three of the nodes are right next to each other on the root end.

- Harvesting, processing, drying and curing ... What, where, when and how?
Harvesting should be done in winter. Harvesting while the bamboo is growing can cause the poles to warp.
I'm not sure on drying but I've seen people talk of drying for a few years before making a good flute.
The bamboo should be cut below the ground level with at least 4 or 5 notes of roots. Three need to be used for the finished flutes.

[Mark Meckes]

Hi eric, thanks for the info!

Do you have specs for the outside diameter?

I recently saw some black bamboo, Phyllostachys nigra in central Georgia, some that were 2+ inches in diameter. I suppose that would be too big, eh?
Madake, Phyllostachys bambusoides, has historically been one of the most widely used bamboos in Japan, (for many purposes), so I'm wondering if it's use for Shakuhachi flutes is mainly based on design and tradition, more common availability, (or lack of availability to other Phyllostachys species with similar characteristics).

Mark

[Angel]

Madaké -Ph bambusoides- is the bamboo used for pro shakuhachi, although Monty also use Ph nigra for student grade shak.
There are several Ph that are quite similar to madaké, but on my experience, there is no other Phyllostachys with the elegant shape of some pieces of bambusoides.
I use very selected pieces of Ph aurea -that develops great diameter and strenght here at the delta del Paraná, Buenos Aires
Disposition of nodes -7, and with space enough to fit toneholes between them- is rarely see in aurea. Also, bambusoides expands the diameter close to the soil (like a bell, or a skirt), feature very rare in aurea, that almost always has less external diameter at the very near the soil than a cms above.
Ph nigra sometimes give very beautiful culms also, but usually nodes aren't too close at the root.
Out of Phyllostachys, I made a Bambusa vulgaris vitatta F# shakuhachi that I love it, very very thick and good nodes distribution -maybee I can post a photo with some time.
Angel

[Mark Meckes]

Okay, now I see, (not being a flute maker), positioning of the tone holes must be within these internode spacings, therefore culms should be selected with nodes at prescribed distances for the type of flute being made...
True, that a Phyllostachys bambusoides culm has the characteristics of beginning with shorter internode spacings, though in a grove, each culm can vary...
I recently returned from a trip across the Southeast USA visiting 70+ species of bamboo, and I saw many species that within the groves, culms could have been selected based on specific diameter and internode spacings. I hope to return again some time, and will want to take a template of node spacings, and take notes of species possibilities.

Mark

[Angel]

Mark,
When go to the bamboo clump, carry with you either a shak or a mock up to compare with live culms internode spacing to place toneholes.
Several Phyllostachys species might fit with that. Of course are many other factors apart this, as curvatures, maturity, front of the culm, etc

Angel

[Mark Meckes]

Thanks for the tips Angel! I wish I had thought about this last trip!
I would have harvested some for others to experiment with. I don't make flutes or want to be a regular supplier, but as per Ericswain's request for Sources of root-end bamboo for flute making? (http://www.bamboocraft.net/forums/showthread.php?t=1112), I believe that others may be interested if they knew what possible species, material specifications and procedures were involved.
Most growers who dig bamboo already have the tools for the task.
It's just a matter getting a reasonable price for the effort which can be achieved by providing the highest quality materials.
With the right tools and techniques, digging them out isn't too difficult, though washing off the dirt, clipping off the roots around the root end and preparing them for drying is time-consuming.

Mark

[Bamboozle]

I know that the Shakuhachi is the traditional instrument that have root ends left on. I sometimes make Native American style flutes with the root end left on. I can see why Shakuhachi sell for $350.00 to $450.00, and many times more than that. There are so many things that have to be just right before they are accepted by a Shak player. I've also made flutes in the Shak design and tuning without any root end.

There is no good reason to remove the root ends for a flute of any style and size, unless you just think it's too much trouble. It IS much more trouble to make the root ended flutes.

I am NOT saying that any flute with a root end should be called a Shakuhachi. There's much more to a Shak than having a root end.

[Henry Lee]

I am starting a new hobby in bamboo flute making too. So far I found that the Japanese use high altitude P. bambusoides almost exclusively. But the Chinese use a more variety of Phyllostachys including pubescen, angustas, and nigra. That's because the Chinese requirements aren't as strict as the Japanese. The Chinese flute has 2 or 4 tuning holes on the underside and the Japanese don't and therefore harder to make.
Chinese flutes
Japanese shak

[asnor69]

We have here in Malaysia, not being a flutemaker myself, nor a regular supplier, or wanting to be one, a species of bamboo, a bit like Dendrocalamus minor amoenus but the diameters are around 2 to 5 cm only, long internodes and thickness at the root end can reach 1-1.5 cm. If that fits your bill let me know. just let me know the treatment to be applied and I can even send it to you by courier service.

[Henry Lee]

Thanks for your interest and offer, asnor69. The 2-5cm diameter is a good size. Most of my flutes are 3 to 3.5 cm diameter with 5 to 8 mm of wall at the top opening, which is about 54 cm from the root end. My root end diameter is from 3.5 to 5 cm. I'd love to see some photos of the bamboo.

[asnor69]

Dear Henry,

I will get the photos once my latest supplies arrive. I usually use materials of your description as decorative items for my products.

[asnor69]

Dear Henry,

You are in luck. I just got back from the bamboo farm. I brought back with me 10 sticks of bamboo of your description. The diameter at 85cm ranging from 1.4cm to 3 cm. Wall thickness is between 4mm to 10mm. The main characteristic of this species is that the diameter size variance is around 3mm from root to tip (up to 40feet) and they are straight all the way up. In a bunch of 400-500 poles, around 30-40 only that will be bent naturally. FYI, there is more where that came from. The beauty of it is that all of them are mature enough to have the walls turning teak colour already. I don't think you will have any cracks once they dried up. I'll email to you the photos once they are ready as I do not have a digital camera at hand now.

[asnor69]

Dear Henry and all shak makers,

Please check if these materials fit your shakahauchi's making requirement.

Root end bamboo with diameters between 1cm to 3.5 cm. Wall thickness above 4mm.

http://www.bamboocraft.net/workshop/data/525/thumbs/RootEndBamboo-001S.jpg See photo (http://www.bamboocraft.net/workshop/showphoto.php?photo=1414&cat=500&ppuser=1331) http://www.bamboocraft.net/workshop/data/525/thumbs/RootEndBamboo-002S.jpg See photo (http://www.bamboocraft.net/workshop/showphoto.php?photo=1413&cat=500&ppuser=1331) http://www.bamboocraft.net/workshop/data/525/thumbs/RootEndBamboo-003S.jpg See photo (http://www.bamboocraft.net/workshop/showphoto.php?photo=1412&cat=500&ppuser=1331)
http://www.bamboocraft.net/workshop/data/525/thumbs/RootEndBamboo-004S.jpg See photo (http://www.bamboocraft.net/workshop/showphoto.php?photo=1411&cat=500&ppuser=1331)